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In the Mood for Love
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For the album by Jo Stafford, see In the Mood for Love (album).
In the Mood for Love
Traditional
花樣年華
Simplified
花样年华
Mandarin
huāyàng niánhuá
Cantonese
faa1 joeng6 nin4 waa4
Shanghainese
ho1 hhian3 nyi3 hho3
Literally
flowery years
Directed by
Wong Kar-wai
Produced by
Wong Kar-wai
Written by
Wong Kar-wai
Starring
Maggie Cheung
Tony Leung
Music by
Michael Galasso
Shigeru Umebayashi
Cinematography
Christopher Doyle
Mark Lee Ping Bin
Edited by
William Chang
Distributed by
Universal Pictures (US)
Release date
29 September 2000 (2000-09-29)
Running time
98 minutes
Country
Hong Kong
Language
Cantonese
Shanghainese
French
Box office
$12,854,953
In the Mood for Love is a 2000 romantic Hong Kong film written, produced, and directed by Wong Kar-wai. It tells the story of a man (played by Tony Leung) and a woman (Maggie Cheung) whose spouses have an affair together and who slowly develop feelings for each other.
In the Mood for Love premiered on 20 May 2000, at the 2000 Cannes Film Festival,[1][2] where it was nominated for the Palme d'Or and Tony Leung was awarded Best Actor (first Hong Kong actor to win this award at Cannes). It is frequently listed as one of the greatest films of the 2000s and one of the major works of Asian cinema, and in 2016 was voted as the second best film of the 21st century by 177 film critics from around the world.
The movie forms the second part of an informal trilogy: The first part was Days of Being Wild[3] (released in 1990) and the last part was 2046 (released in 2004).
Contents
1 Plot
2 Cast
3 Title
4 Development and pre-production
5 Production
6 Title song
7 Soundtrack
8 Box office
9 Reception
9.1 Lists
9.2 Awards
10 See also
11 References
12 External links
Plot[edit]
The story takes place in an exiled Shanghainese community of Hong Kong in 1962. Chow Mo-wan (Tony Leung), a journalist, rents a room in an apartment of a building on the same day as Su Li-zhen (Maggie Cheung), a secretary from a shipping company. They become next-door neighbours. Each has a spouse who works and often leaves them alone on overtime shifts. Despite the presence of a friendly Shanghainese landlady, Mrs. Suen, and bustling, mahjong-playing neighbours, Chow and Su often find themselves alone in their rooms. Their lives continue to intersect in everyday situations: a recurring motif is the loneliness of eating alone. The film documents the leads' chance encounters, each making his and her individual trek to the street noodle stall.
Chow and Su each nurse suspicions about one's own spouse's fidelity; each comes to the conclusion that their spouses have been seeing each other. Su wonders aloud how their spouses' affair might have begun. Su and Chow re-enact what they imagine might have happened.
Chow soon invites Su to help him write a martial arts serial for the papers. Their neighbours begin to take notice of Su's prolonged absences. In the context of a socially conservative 1960s Hong Kong, friendships between men and women bear scrutiny. Chow rents a hotel room away from the apartment where he and Su can work together without attracting attention. The relationship between Chow and Su is platonic, as there is the suggestion that they would be degraded if they stooped to the level of their spouses. As time passes, however, they acknowledge that they have developed feelings for each other. Chow leaves Hong Kong for a job in Singapore. He asks Su to go with him; Chow waits for her at the hotel room and then leaves. She can be seen rushing down the stairs of her apartment, only to arrive at the empty hotel room, too late to join Chow.
The next year, Su goes to Singapore and visits Chow's apartment. She calls Chow, who is working for a Singaporean newspaper, but she remains silent when Chow picks up. Later, Chow realises she has visited his apartment after seeing a lipstick-stained cigarette butt in his ashtray. While dining with a friend, Chow relays a story about how in older times, when a person had a secret that could not be shared, he would instead go atop a mountain, make a hollow in a tree, whisper the secret into that hollow and cover it with mud.
Three years later, Su visits her former landlady, Mrs. Suen. Mrs. Suen is about to emigrate to the United States, and Su inquires about whether the apartment is available for rent. Some time later, Chow returns to visit his landlords, the Koos. He finds they have emigrated to the Philippines. He asks about the Suen family next door, and the new owner tells him a woman and her son are now living next door. He leaves without realising Su is the lady living there.
The film ends at Siem Reap, Cambodia, where Chow is seen visiting Angkor Wat. At the site of a ruined monastery, he whispers for some time into a hollow in a ruined wall, before plugging the hollow with mud.
Cast[edit]
Maggie Cheung as Su Li-zhen (Mrs. Chan)
Tony Leung as Chow Mo-wan
Siu Ping Lam as Ah Ping
Rebecca Pan as Mrs. Suen, the Chans' landlady
Kelly Lai Chen as Mr. Ho, Su Li-zhen's employer
Joe Cheung as man living in Mr. Koo's apartment
Chan Man-Lei as Mr. Koo, Chow Mo-Wan's landlord
Chin Tsi-ang as the amah (female servant)
Roy Cheung as Mr. Chan (voice)
Paulyn Sun as Mrs. Chow (voice)
Title[edit]
The film's original Chinese title, meaning "the age of blossoms" or "the flowery years" – Chinese metaphor for the fleeting time of youth, beauty and love – derives from a song of the same name by Zhou Xuan from a 1946 film. The English title derives from the song, "I'm in the Mood for Love". Director Wong had planned to name the film Secrets, until listening to the song late in post-production.
Development and pre-production[edit]
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In the Mood for Love went through a long gestation period. In the 1990s, Wong Kar-wai found some commercial success, much critical acclaim, and wide influence on other filmmakers throughout Asia and the world with films such as Chungking Express and Fallen Angels, both set in present-day Hong Kong. His 1997 film Happy Together was also successful internationally, winning him Best Director at the Cannes Film Festival and surprising many. It was even popular with mainstream audiences in Hong Kong, despite its then-unusual focus on a gay love story and its having been largely improvised in Argentina, a landscape unfamiliar to Wong. By the end of the decade, with sovereignty of Hong Kong transferred from Britain to the People's Republic of China, Wong was eager to work once more in the mainland, where he had been born. He had been dissatisfied with the final result of his 1994 wuxia epic Ashes of Time, which was set in ancient times and filmed in remote desert regions, and decided to deal with a more 20th century urban setting.
By 1998, Wong had developed a concept for his next film, Summer in Beijing. Although no script was finalized, he and cameraman Christopher Doyle had been to Tiananmen Square and other areas of the city to do a small amount of unauthorized shooting. Wong told journalists the film was to be a musical and a love story. Wong secured the participation of Tony Leung Chiu-wai and Maggie Cheung to star, and with his background in graphic design, had even made posters for the film. He had begun work on script treatments, which since Days of Being Wild he tended to treat as only a very loose basis for his work to secure financing, preferring to leave things open to change during the shoot.
It transpired that there would be difficulties securing permission to shoot in Beijing with Wong's spontaneous methods of working and potential political sensitivities in setting his film in mid-20th century China. Wong had come to think of Summer in Beijing as a triptych of stories, much like his original concept of Chungking Express (in which the third story had been spun off into the film Fallen Angels). Quickly, Wong decided to jettison this structure, saving only one of the three planned stories, which had been titled provisionally, A Story of Food, and dealt with a woman and a man who shared noodles and secrets. As he reunited with his actors and production team, most of whom had collaborated several times before, Wong decided A Story of Food would be the heart of his next film. The story would slowly evolve into In the Mood for Love, after transposing its setting away from mainland China and back to 1960s Hong Kong.
Wong had set his breakthrough Days of Being Wild in that time in Hong Kong, when mainland-born Chinese and their memories, including those of Wong, then a young child, had a strong presence in the territory. Still saturated with the sounds of 1930s and 1940s Shanghai singing stars and the ideals they represented, the time also reminded him of the wide array of vibrant dance music floating in over the Pacific from the Philippines, Hawaii, Latin America and the United States, which Wong had used as a backdrop in Days of Being Wild. Wong had regarded Days of Being Wild upon its release in 1990, as an artistic success, and had planned a sequel to it. However, his producers had been disappointed by its box office returns, particularly given that its shoot had been prolonged and expensive, with Wong, who had come out of the Hong Kong industry, first attempting to work more independently, including collaborating for the first time with cinematographer Christopher Doyle, who favored jazz-like spontaneity in his shooting methods. Despite involving many of Hong Kong's top stars, the film's profits had been modest, so Wong was not given the opportunity to follow it up. Yet as he moved on to other films, he had always retained the dream of doing so. With the impossibility of the original idea of Summer in Beijing, he was now able to pursue it.
The cast of Maggie Cheung and Tony Leung in A Story of Food (soon to become In the Mood for Love) provided an opportunity to pick up a loose thread of Days of Being Wild, as the actors had appeared in that film, although never together. Leung's few scenes had been left incomplete, awaiting Wong's planned sequel that was never made. 2046, a sequel in its plot to In the Mood for Love, would later serve for Wong as a sequel in spirit to Days of Being Wild, connecting the story of Leung's character in Days and In the Mood. The writing of 2046 essentially began at the same time as that of In the Mood for Love. Because neither film had its plot, structure, or even all its characters, scripted in advance, Wong began working on the ideas that eventually made it into 2046 during the shoot of In the Mood for Love. As he and his collaborators made the film in a variety of settings, its story took shape. Eventually, these constantly developing ideas, taken from one of the remnants of Summer in Beijing, were developed too much to fit into one film. Wong discarded most of the footage and story before arriving at In the Mood, later reshooting and reimagining the rest as 2046.
Production[edit]
Wong's plan to make a film set primarily in Hong Kong did not simplify matters when it came to the shoot. The city's appearance was much changed since the 1960s, and Wong's personal nostalgia for the time added to his desire for historical accuracy. Wong had little taste for working in studio settings, let alone using special effects to imitate the look of past times. Christopher Doyle later discussed the necessity of filming where the streets, the buildings, and even the sight of clothes hanging on lines (as in 1960s Hong Kong) could give a real energy to the actors and the story, whose outlines were constantly open to revision as shooting progressed. While set in Hong Kong, a portion of the filming (like outdoor and hotel scenes) was shot in less modernized neighborhoods of Bangkok, Thailand. Further, a brief portion later in the film is set in Singapore (one of Wong's initial inspirations on the story had been a short story set in Singapore, Intersection, by the Hong Kong writer Liu Yichang). In its final sequences, the film also incorporates footage of Angkor Wat, Cambodia, where Leung's character is working as a journalist.
The film took 15 months to shoot.[2] The actors found the process inspiring but demanding. They required a lot of work to understand the times, being slightly younger than Wong and having grown up in a rapidly changing Hong Kong or, in Maggie Cheung's case, partly in the United Kingdom.
Cheung portrayed 1930s Chinese screen icon Ruan Lingyu in Stanley Kwan's 1992 film Center Stage, for which she wore qipao, the dresses worn by stylish Chinese women throughout much of the first half of the 20th century. It had been Cheung's most recognized performance to date and her hardest, partly due to the clothing, which restricted her freedom of movement. For Wong's film, Cheung, playing a married woman in her thirties who had carried over the elegance of her younger years in the pre-revolutionary mainland, would again wear qipao, known in Cantonese as cheongsam, and spoke of it as the way of understanding her character Su Li-zhen, whose quiet strength Cheung felt was unlike her own more spontaneous spirit.
The cinematographer Christopher Doyle, for whom the film was the sixth collaboration with Wong Kar-wai,[4] had to leave when production went over schedule and was replaced by Mark Lee Ping Bin, renowned for his work with Taiwanese filmmaker Hou Hsiao-hsien.[2] Both DPs are credited equally for the final film. Some scenes in the final cut are thought to have been shot by each, with some critics noting differences between Doyle's more kinetic style as seen in earlier Wong movies, and the more subtle long shots of Lee framing key parts of In the Mood for Love.
Critic Tony Rayns, on the other hand, noted in a commentary on another Wong film that the differing styles of the two cinematographers were blended seamlessly by Wong's own fluid aesthetic. Like all of Wong's previous work, this one was shot on film, not digitally.
Doyle's departure did not result from major artistic arguments with Wong. However, despite his agreement with Wong's spontaneous approach to scripting, he found it frustrating to reshoot many of the key moments over and over in environments throughout Southeast Asia until they felt right to the director. He had to turn down many other projects due to the total commitment, without a clear time limit, required by Wong. Several years later Doyle initially signed on to work on the sequel 2046, but he also abandoned that project halfway through for similar reasons (being replaced by a range of DPs) and has not worked with Wong since. Tony Leung, on the other hand, returned to work on 2046, in which he starred without Maggie Cheung, who made only a brief appearance in already shot footage from In the Mood for Love. Leung also starred in Wong's 2013 film, The Grandmaster. Cheung felt In the Mood for Love was the high point of her career, and she has worked much more infrequently since, starring in several films soon after but within four years, all but retired from acting, despite winning a Best Actress Award at Cannes for 2004's Clean.
The final months of production and post-production on In the Mood for Love, a submission to the Cannes Film Festival in May 2000, were notorious for their confusion. The film was barely finished in time for the festival, as would occur again four years later when Wong submitted 2046. Wong continued shooting more and more of In the Mood for Love with the cast and crew as he worked furiously to edit the massive amounts of footage he had shot over the past year. He removed large chunks of the story to strip it down to its most basic element, the relationship between these characters in the 1960s, with brief allusions to earlier and later times. In the meantime, Wong screened brief segments before the festival for journalists and distributors. Despite the general lack of commercial interest in Chinese cinema at the time by North American media corporations, Wong was given a distribution deal for a limited theatrical release in North America on USA Films, based only on a few minutes of footage.
By early 2000, with the deadline for Cannes approaching, Wong was contacted by the director of Cannes, who encouraged him to quickly complete a final cut, and offered a constructive criticism about the title. Although the title in Cantonese and Mandarin is based on a Zhou Xuan song whose English title is translated "Age of Bloom", the international title proved more complex. After discarding Summer in Beijing and A Story of Food, Wong had provisionally settled on Secrets, but Cannes felt this title was not as distinctive as the film Wong was preparing and suggested he should change it.
Finally having completed the cut, but at a loss for titles, Wong was listening to a then-recent album by Bryan Ferry and Roxy Music, called Slave To Love: The Very Best Of The Ballads, and noticed a resonance in the song "I'm In the Mood for Love", which shared its title with a popular jazz standard of the mid 20th century. Many of Wong's previous English language titles had come from pop songs, so he found this title particularly appropriate.
Three years later, Sofia Coppola credited In the Mood for Love as her largest inspiration on her Academy Award-winning film Lost in Translation, which itself ended with secrets being shared, and made important use of another song by Bryan Ferry. Lost in Translation's iconic opening shot was inspired by a shot from In the Mood For Love. Coppola thanked Wong Kar-wai in her Oscar acceptance speech.
Wong states he was very influenced by Hitchcock's Vertigo while making this film and compares Tony Leung's character to James Stewart's:
[T]he role of Tony in the film reminds me of Jimmy Stewart's in Vertigo. There is a dark side to this character. I think it's very interesting that most of the audience prefers to think that this is a very innocent relationship. These are the good guys, because their spouses are the first ones to be unfaithful and they refuse to be. Nobody sees any darkness in these characters – and yet they are meeting in secret to act out fictitious scenarios of confronting their spouses and of having an affair. I think this happens because the face of Tony Leung is so sympathetic. Just imagine if it was John Malkovich playing this role. You would think, 'This guy is really weird.' It's the same in Vertigo. Everybody thinks James Stewart is a nice guy, so nobody thinks that his character is actually very sick."[5]
Title song[edit]
The title track "Hua Yang De Nian Hua" is a song by famous singer Zhou Xuan from the Solitary Island period. The 1946 song is a paean to a happy past and an oblique metaphor for the darkness of Japanese-occupied Shanghai. Wong also set the song to his 2000 short film, named Hua Yang De Nian Hua after the track.
Soundtrack[edit]
Shigeru Umebayashi: "Yumeji's Theme" (originally from the soundtrack of Seijun Suzuki's Yumeji)
Michael Galasso: "Angkor Wat Theme", "ITMFL", "Casanova/Flute"
Nat King Cole: "Aquellos Ojos Verdes", "Te Quiero Dijiste", "Quizás, Quizás, Quizás"
Bryan Ferry: "I'm in the Mood for Love" (the inspiration for the English title, found on, e.g., the French two-CD soundtrack, not in the film)
Zhou Xuan: 《花樣的年華》 "Hua Yang De Nian Hua" (the inspiration for the original Chinese title)
Rebecca Pan: "Bengawan Solo"
All of the traditional pingtan, Cantonese, Beijing and Zhejiang operas are historic recordings[6]
Box office[edit]
In the Mood for Love made HK$8,663,227 during its Hong Kong run.
On 2 February 2001, the film opened in six North American theatres, earning $113,280 ($18,880 per screen) in its first weekend. It finished its North American run with a gross of $2,738,980.[7]
The total worldwide box office gross was US$12,854,953.[7]
Reception[edit]
On review aggregator website Rotten Tomatoes, the film holds an approval rating of 89%, based on 123 reviews, and an average rating of 7.8/10. The website's critical consensus reads, "This understated romance, featuring good performances by its leads, is both visually beautiful and emotionally moving."[8] On Metacritic, the film has a weighted average score of 85 out of 100, based on 28 critics, indicating "universal acclaim".[9]
Lists[edit]
In 2000, Empire ranked it number 42 in its "The 100 Best Films Of World Cinema" list.[10] It was ranked 95th on "100 Best Films from 1983 to 2008" by Entertainment Weekly.[11] In November 2009, Time Out New York ranked the film as the fifth-best of the decade, calling it the "consummate unconsummated love story of the new millennium."[12]
They Shoot Pictures, Don't They?, a review aggregator covering the history of cinema, lists In the Mood for Love as the 45th most acclaimed film of all time, making it also the most widely acclaimed film released anywhere in the world since its release in 2000.[13] In the 2012 Sight & Sound critics poll, In the Mood for Love appeared at number 24, making it the highest ranked film from the 2000s and one of only two from the 2000s to be listed in the top 50 of all time, along with David Lynch's Mulholland Drive. Wong's film was also the highest ranked film by a Chinese filmmaker. In the Mood for Love received its placement due to the votes of 42 critics (out of 846) who placed it in their own top ten lists individually.[14]
In 2015, the Busan International Film Festival ranked the film No. 3 in its "Asian Cinema 100" list, behind Yasujirō Ozu's Tokyo Story and Akira Kurosawa's Rashomon.[15]
In 2016, the film appeared in second place on BBC's list of the 100 greatest films of the 21st century, after Mulholland Drive.[16]
Awards[edit]
2000 Cannes Film Festival
Won: Best Actor (Tony Leung Chiu-wai)[17]
Won: Technical Grand Prize (Christopher Doyle, Lee Ping-bing, William Chang)[17]
Nominated: Palme d'Or[17]
2001 Hong Kong Film Awards
Won: Best Actor (Tony Leung Chiu-wai)
Won: Best Actress (Maggie Cheung)
Won: Best Art Direction (William Chang)
Won: Best Costume and Make-up Design (William Chang)
Won: Best Film Editing (William Chang)
Nominated: Best Picture
Nominated: Best Director (Wong Kar-wai)
Nominated: Best Supporting Actress (Poon Dick-wah)
Nominated: Best Screenplay (Wong Kar-wai)
Nominated: Best New Performer (Siu Ping-lam)
Nominated: Best Cinematography (Christopher Doyle, Lee Pin-bing)
Nominated: Best Original Score (Michael Galasso)
2000 Golden Horse Film Festival and Awards
Won: Best Actress (Maggie Cheung)
2001 Hong Kong Film Critics Society Awards
Won: Best Director (Wong Kar-wai)
Won: Film of merit
2001 Belgian Syndicate of Cinema Critics (Belgium)
Won: Grand Prix
2002 National Society of Film Critics (USA)
Won: Best Foreign Language Film
Won: Best Cinematography (Christopher Doyle, Lee Pin-bing)
2001 César Awards
Won: Best Foreign Film
2001 German Film Awards
Won: Best Foreign Film
2001 New York Film Critics Circle Awards
Won: Best Foreign Language Film
Won: Best Cinematography (Christopher Doyle, Lee Pin-bing)
2001 BAFTA Awards
Nominated: Best Foreign Language Film
2002 Argentinian Film Critics Association Awards
Won: Best Foreign Language Film
2000 Asia-Pacific Film Festival
Won: Best Cinematography (Christopher Doyle, Lee Pin-bing)
Won: Best Editing (William Chang)
2001 Australian Film Institute Awards
Nominated: Best Foreign Language Film
2001 British Independent Film Awards
Won: Best Foreign Language Film
2002 Broadcast Film Critics Association Awards
Nominated: Best Foreign Language Film
See also[edit]
Film portal
List of films set in Hong Kong
References[edit]
Jump up ^ IMDb: release dates
^ Jump up to: a b c "Images – In the Mood for Love". imagesjournal.com. Retrieved 13 March 2016.
Jump up ^ "Director's Statement". In the Mood for Love official website. Archived from the original on 7 August 2010. Retrieved 7 August 2010.
Jump up ^ "Christopher Doyle (Cinematographer)". In the Mood for Love official website. Archived from the original on 7 August 2010. Retrieved 7 August 2010.
Jump up ^ Chute, David (15 February 2001). "Unforgettable". LA Weekly. Archived from the original on 7 August 2010. Retrieved 7 August 2010.
Jump up ^ "Notes on the Music". In the Mood for Love official website. Archived from the original on 7 August 2010. Retrieved 7 August 2010.
^ Jump up to: a b "In the Mood for Love (2001)". Box Office Mojo. Retrieved 7 August 2010.
Jump up ^ "In the Mood for Love (2001)". Rotten Tomatoes. Fandango Media. Retrieved April 10, 2018.
Jump up ^ "In the Mood for Love Reviews". Metacritic. CBS Interactive. Retrieved April 10, 2018.
Jump up ^ "The 100 Best Films Of World Cinema | 42. In The Mood For Love". Empire. 2010. Archived from the original on 7 August 2010. Retrieved 7 August 2010.
Jump up ^ "Counting Down the New Movie Classics: No. 100-76". Entertainment Weekly. 20 June 2008. Archived from the original on 22 August 2010. Retrieved 12 July 2013.
Jump up ^ "The TONY top 50 movies of the decade". Time Out New York. 25 November 2009. Retrieved 2 December 2009.
Jump up ^ "TSPDT – 21st century – Films 1 to 50" Archived 15 October 2011 at the Wayback Machine.. They Shoot Pictures, Don't They?. January 2010. Retrieved 5 January 2011.
Jump up ^ Christie, Ian (1 August 2012). "The Top 50 Greatest Films of All Time". Sight & Sound. British Film Institute. Retrieved 12 July 2013.
Jump up ^ Frater, Patrick (August 12, 2015). "Busan Festival Proposes Ranking of Best-Ever Asian Films". Variety.
Jump up ^ "The 21st Century's 100 Greatest Films". BBC. 23 August 2016.
^ Jump up to: a b c "Festival de Cannes: In the Mood for Love". festival-cannes.com. Retrieved 10 October 2009.
External links[edit]
Wikiquote has quotations related to: In the Mood for Love
Official website
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In the Mood for Love at Box Office Mojo
In the Mood for Love at Metacritic
In the Mood for Love at Rotten Tomatoes
Criterion Collection essay by Li Cheuk-to
show
v
t
e
Wong Kar-wai
Filmography
Awards and nominations
Feature films
As Tears Go By (1988)
Days of Being Wild (1990)
Chungking Express (1994)
Ashes of Time (1994)
Fallen Angels (1995)
Happy Together (1997)
In the Mood for Love (2000)
2046 (2004)
My Blueberry Nights (2007)
The Grandmaster (2013)
Short films
and segments
Wkw/tk/1996@7'55"hk.net (1996)
Hua Yang De Nian Hua (2000)
The Follow (2001)
#Music video|"Six Days" (2002)
"The Hand" in Eros (2004)
"I Travelled 9000 km To Give It To You" in To Each His Own Cinema (2007)
There's Only One Sun (2007)
Television series
Tong Wars (TBA)
show
v
t
e
César Award for Best Foreign Film
Scent of a Woman (1976)
We All Loved Each Other So Much (1977)
A Special Day (1978)
The Tree of Wooden Clogs (1979)
Manhattan (1980)
Kagemusha (1981)
The Elephant Man (1982)
Victor/Victoria (1983)
Fanny and Alexander (1984)
Amadeus (1985)
The Purple Rose of Cairo (1986)
The Name of the Rose (1987)
The Last Emperor (1988)
Bagdad Café (1989)
Dangerous Liaisons (1990)
Dead Poets Society (1991)
Toto the Hero (1992)
High Heels (1993)
The Piano (1994)
Four Weddings and a Funeral (1995)
Land and Freedom (1996)
Breaking the Waves (1997)
Brassed Off (1998)
Life Is Beautiful (1999)
All About My Mother (2000)
In the Mood for Love (2001)
Mulholland Drive (2002)
Bowling for Columbine (2003)
Mystic River (2004)
Lost in Translation (2005)
Million Dollar Baby (2006)
Little Miss Sunshine (2007)
The Lives of Others (2008)
Waltz with Bashir (2009)
Gran Torino (2010)
The Social Network (2011)
A Separation (2012)
Argo (2013)
The Broken Circle Breakdown (2014)
Mommy (2015)
Birdman (2016)
I, Daniel Blake (2017)
Loveless (2018)
Authority control
WorldCat Identities
BNF: cb14459770q (data)
GND: 7509958-5
SUDOC: 077763106
VIAF: 186565885
Retrieved from "https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=In_the_Mood_for_Love&oldid=854465566"
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Talk:List of extreme points of the United States/Archive 1
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< Talk:List of extreme points of the United States
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This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.
Archive 1 Archive 2
Contents
[hide]
1 Longitude and the Aleutians
2 little globe thingy
3 little globe thingy
4 Deepest / Farthest below water surface
5 Most remote point in all US territory
6 coordinate precision: too much?
7 Easternmost point of the USA.... by direction of travel?
8 Extremes of Habitation, etc.
9 Reorganize East-West
10 Easternmost points
11 Islands
12 World's most voluminous lake
13 Geographic center of North America vs. Geographic Center of the North American Continent??
14 DMS/DD
Longitude and the Aleutians
You know, if you go by the lat/lon numbers, there are US islands in the Aleutian chain that have longitudes close to 180 deg East. That's way farther east than Maine.
little globe thingy
I just added info on Anc
little globe thingy
I just added info on Anchor Point Alaska being the westernmost point on the continuous highway system, with a ref and coordinates, but I don't know how to do the fancy little trick with the little globe that links to a map that many of the other entries have. Little help? Beeblebrox (talk) 20:01, 15 August 2009 (UTC)
Deepest / Farthest below water surface
As the claim is worded, Lake Superior is much deeper than Puget Sound. But, since Lake Superior's surface is at about 600 feet above sea level, the bottom of Puget Sound has a point that is farther below sea level than the depths of Lake Superior.
The unreferenced claim for Puget Sound that I removed called out a depth of 933 feet. With a good, although not comprehensive, look at the appropriate chart, I could not find a 933 foot depth -- the deepest sounding I found was 756 feet, between Alki Point and Decatur reef.
Unless someone can find the 933 foot depth, I will soon add the 756 foot Puget Sound depth as "Deepest depth below sea level" to the list. I will also set coords for both.. . . . Jim . . . . Jameslwoodward (talk • contribs) 11:48, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
The calculations here are:
Lake Superior: Sounding is 1,333 feet. Chart datum (as given on chart 14963) is 601.1 feet above mean sea level at Rimouski, Quebec (at the mouth of the Saint Lawrence River, the entrance to the Great Lakes). Ignoring the fact that mean sea level at Rimouski may be several feet different from the general mean sea level used for other charts and maps, we can say that the deepest point in Lake Superior is 732 feet below sea level. I'm a little concerned that we're playing loose and free with precision here -- I might prefer to say "approximately 730 feet" or even "approximately 700 feet", but I think that will confuse more than it will help and it doesn't really matter as the nearest competitor is 200 feet away.
Puget Sound: Sounding is 949 feet. Chart datum is lower low water. Mean high water, as tabulated on the chart is 10.5 feet. Mean low water is 2.8 feet. Therefore, mean sea level is 6.65 feet above the chart datum (this is not exactly right, but close enough) or approximately 7 feet when rounded appropriately. Therefore, the sounding is 956 feet below mean sea level at Madison Point, Puget Sound. The same caution that this isn't a general mean sea level applies. . . . . Jim . . . . Jameslwoodward (talk • contribs) 13:33, 18 December 2009 (UTC)
-I see now that I misread the information on chart 18446 about the surface level of the water in Puget Sound. I'm just trying to make sure I understand it now. From your calculations it seems that you're saying the mean level of the water is equivalent to sea level. Would that be correct? --Lasunncty (talk) 07:26, 19 December 2009 (UTC)
The easy answer is "yes". "Sea level" or "mean sea level", from which all elevations in this list are measured, is a construct which has many variables, but it boils down to tide gauges at many points around the coast constantly recording the height of the water. Mean Sea Level is the average of all these measurements. Since the mariner doesn't care about the Mean Sea Level, but only highs (how much clearance under a bridge) and lows (how much water under the keel), Mean Sea Level doesn't appear on nautical charts.
I approximated it as follows:
Puget Sound, like most places, has two tides each day. The two highs and two lows are not the same height. The numbers look like this, top to bottom:
Mean Higher High Water - the average of all of the higher of the two high tides each day
Mean High Water -- the average of all high tides
Mean Sea Level (not on the chart) -- the average level of the sea
Mean Low Water -- the average of all low tides
Mean Lower Low Water -- (the chart datum) the average of all of the lower of the two tides each day.
Extreme Low Water -- the lowest recorded water level
If you assume that the tidal level plots as a perfect sine curve each day, then Mean Sea Level would be the average of Mean High Water and Mean Low Water. Since it's not a perfect sine curve, for a variety of reasons, including rivers, the shape of the inlet, and so forth, Mean Sea Level will not be exactly the average of Mean High Water and Mean Low Water, but it will be close, probably within a foot here.. . . . Jim . . . . Jameslwoodward (talk • contribs) 12:18, 19 December 2009 (UTC)
Thank you, that makes sense. I guess the point I was getting at, though, was if you considered Puget Sound to be equivalent to "the sea". Lake Superior, for instance, is ~600 feet above sea level, but is Puget Sound at sea level? --Lasunncty (talk) 08:35, 20 December 2009 (UTC)
Good question. That's why I was careful to point out that mean sea level at Rimouski is not necessarily the same as at Puget Sound. Neither will match the datum used for elevations for the USA.
There's more than you ever wanted to know at the datum information for Seattle, the nearest reference tide station and its various helps and FAQs. . . . . Jim . . . . Jameslwoodward (talk • contribs) 16:11, 20 December 2009 (UTC)
Most remote point in all US territory
This is a candidate and is my basis for changing the claimant in Alaska to "most remote in the 50 states", but I'm not sure it's actually the most remote of all -- it needs a little more work in the Pacific to prove.
Most remote point in all U.S. territory: Howland Island, 0°48′07″N 176°38′3″W / 0.80194°N 176.63417°W / 0.80194; -176.63417Coordinates: 0°48′07″N 176°38′3″W / 0.80194°N 176.63417°W / 0.80194; -176.63417, 422 miles (680 km) from Kanton Island, Kiribati, which itself has a population of only 41
. . . . Jim . . . . Jameslwoodward (talk • contribs) 15:59, 12 January 2010 (UTC)
coordinate precision: too much?
Some of the degree coordinates have 12 or 13 digits past the decimal point, meaning that the imprecision in the last digit is on the order of a micrometer or less. What is the rationale for such excessive precision? I am going to round these to a more reasonable precision in the meantime. Baccyak4H (Yak!) 18:07, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
I got those coordinates from the US Census boundary files for these locations. I don't know if they really measured it to that precision or not. --Lasunncty (talk) 23:39, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
Easternmost point of the USA.... by direction of travel?
I am responding to your revision to the eastern most point in the USA (Pt Udall, St Croix, USVI)
I had edited the St Croix location out of 'most eastern point' because it is not the most eastern point of the USA. The US has Pacific island territories (such as Guam) that are located farther east than any US territory in the Caribbean.
Previously, it had been stated that the St Croix point was the most eastern point 'by direction of travel'... this is a random measurement system. If you are considering it the most eastern point by direction of travel via boat, the US Pacific islands (Minor Outlying Islands) are still farther east. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.8.66.103 (talk) 06:27, 19 July 2010 (UTC)
Fundamentally the definition of "by direction of travel" is if you begin in the geographic center of the United States and travel to point X by the shortest possible route, then the farthest such point reachable by traveling east is Point Udall in the Virgin Islands. The points in the Pacific do not qualify because their shortest possible routes require traveling west.
Or, as a graphic example, imagine drawing a line around all US territory, shrinking the line to its minimum possible length, and filling in all the oceans within the line. The Virgin Islands would then be the farthest east you could walk on the new land mass and Guam would be the farthest west.
Or, if you prefer, use a map with the Prime Meridian at Washington DC. Such maps were common in the nineteenth century. On such a map, The Virgin Islands would have the largest east longitude and Guam the farthest west.. . Jim - Jameslwoodward (talk • contribs) 22:50, 19 July 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for your reponse. I am unable to find any definition of 'direction of travel' that correlates your definition. Please post some sites that would clarify. I am also unsure of the true value of this system of measurement in this case. It seems to cause more confusion than anything else by allowing someone to arbitrarily locate a Prime Meridian anywhere they chose. Using this logic, I could place the Prime Meridian anywhere I chose, effectively negating its practical usefulness. I could understand this being used on maps 200 years ago, but those same maps are not used today due to their 'inaccuracies'. If the extreme points of the USA are going to be listed, I don't see how this helps clarify the situation. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.8.66.103 (talk) 21:12, 21 July 2010 (UTC)
Sorry, I'm out of explanation -- it seems very simple to me -- it's the farthest point you can travel to in an easterly direction and still be in the USA without traveling more than half way around the world. The definition doesn't depend on where the Prime Meridian is; in fact, it ignores the Prime Meridian. And, by the way, the entirely separate question of what to use as the Prime Meridian has not been settled for as long as you think -- I own a French chart issued less than 40 years ago that shows the PM at Paris. . . Jim - Jameslwoodward (talk • contribs) 22:34, 21 July 2010 (UTC)
I also have a problem with this being the easternmost point (by travel). Very dubious distinction. If you travel East you get to The Aleutian Islands regardless of the distance traveled, it's still the furthest East. Someone I know quoted this "fact" and I thought no way. Direction of travel is also invalid. Metricmike (talk) 12:02, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
I've been to both Guam and St Croix and it entirely depends on how you measure it. If you measure from the geographical center of the US (roughly in Kansas, the furthest east you can go (without having a shorter route to the same place by going west) is St Croix. Note that their East & West geographical coordinates are irrelevant for this discussion. I COMPLETELY agree that geographically/longitudinally, Alaska claims North, East, and West. Buffs (talk) 18:11, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
This "direction of travel" for determining east west seems to be a silly construct that is unique to Wikipedia. It requires us to put the US as the center of the universe and seems to violate WP:WV--Drewder (talk) 12:15, 18 March 2012 (UTC)
Actually, it is not US-centric at all. This same standard would apply to any country whose territory spans the dateline. It avoids the obvious weirdness of having the easternmost point and the westernmost point be microns apart. YBG (talk) 00:44, 22 March 2012 (UTC)
Extremes of Habitation, etc.
It would be of interest to know the limits of habitation, both for private residences and for residences to which staff are posted. In particular, is the part of Alaska which is in the Eastern hemisphere inhabited at all? 94.30.84.71 (talk) 11:58, 3 July 2011 (UTC)
Also, how about considering the circumscribing circles of the whole 48 States and of the whole 50 States, both by territory and by habitation? 94.30.84.71 (talk) 11:58, 3 July 2011 (UTC)
And how about the contiguous mainland - the points which in principle be reached without crossing water? 94.30.84.71 (talk) 11:58, 3 July 2011 (UTC)
If it is legitimate to consider one point in the Amundsen-Scott South Pole Station as being southernmost, then the Station must contain a line one side of which is Easternmost by longitude and the other Westernmost. 94.30.84.71 (talk) 11:58, 3 July 2011 (UTC)
To answer at least one of your questions, please read the article on Attu Island. Backspace (talk) 22:08, 25 April 2012 (UTC)
Reorganize East-West
Once again someone tried made a 'correction' based on not reading or not understanding the information in the detailed note at the bottom of the article, clearly referenced at the end of the lead. This might be avoided in the future if we had separate sections
Easternmost & Westernmost in the contiguous states
Easternmost & Westernmost by longitude
First sunrise & last sunset
The last two sections could begin with introductory text taken from notes section. Any comments? YBG (talk) 06:45, 27 January 2012 (UTC)
On another point, I have issues with the descriptions of Cape Alava, Cape Blanco, and Cape Mendocino. Does the terminology "miles east of" or "miles west of" have any real meaning when these places are at different latitudes? Backspace (talk) 21:44, 25 April 2012 (UTC)
Easternmost points
Currently the section "Easternmost points" gives
Eastport, Maine — easternmost incorporated city[2]
Calais, Maine — easternmost city of more than 2500 residents
Houlton, Maine — easternmost town of more than 5000 residents
Bangor, Maine — easternmost city of more than 20,000 residents
Portland, Maine — easternmost city of more than 50,000 residents
The comparable items in "Westernmost points" include the phrase "in the 48 contiguous states", and I believe the above should include that as well (or, "in the 50 states"), to be clear that US possessions are not included. Otherwise I presume the correct answers would be San Juan and others in Puerto Rico for the first, fourth, and fifth items, Christiansted, USVI for the second one, and Charlotte Amalie, USVI for the third one.
Also, "by direction of travel" should probably be inserted to be clear that e.g. the municipality of Saipan is excluded.
For that matter, maybe several versions should be included: "easternmost...in the 50 states", and "easternmost...in all U.S. controlled territory, by direction of travel", and "easternmost...in all U.S. controlled territory, by longitude". Duoduoduo (talk) 13:52, 18 February 2013 (UTC)
Good point. I have added the qualifier to each of those statements. --Lasunncty (talk) 10:05, 25 February 2013 (UTC)
And I have now added some places outside the 50 states. --Lasunncty (talk) 23:16, 25 February 2013 (UTC)
Great! Thanks! Duoduoduo (talk) 00:21, 26 February 2013 (UTC)
But I didn't think Christiansted, USVI, was incorporated. Are you sure about that? Duoduoduo (talk) 00:28, 26 February 2013 (UTC)
It is according to the Census Bureau. --Lasunncty (talk) 13:58, 28 February 2013 (UTC)
Islands
That list degenerated into superlatives (Not points) by locales within the US and don't apply to the US as a whole. an island smaller than Hawai'i cannot be an "Extreme points of the United States" any more, it might be an extreme point within whatever location has been highlights (Puget Sound for example) but obviously not the US. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ojmorales0002 (talk • contribs) 00:37, 26 January 2015 (UTC)
World's most voluminous lake
While Lake Superior has, by far, the largest surface area it is by no means the most voluminous freshwater lake in the world. Lake Baikal contains more than twice as much water as Lake Superior, despite having less than half the surface area. Jh338 (talk) 04:57, 25 March 2015 (UTC)
The reference has been changed. You could have Boldly done the same yourself! YBG (talk) 05:19, 25 March 2015 (UTC)
Geographic center of North America vs. Geographic Center of the North American Continent??
"International Falls, Minnesota Geographic center of North America, near the 49th parallel. Distance from ocean about 1,600 miles (2,600 km). 48°35′N 93°24′W
...
The geographic center of the North American continent is located at 48°10′N 100°10′W, about 6 miles (10 km) west of Balta in Pierce County, North Dakota."
What's the difference? -- megA (talk) 18:36, 16 May 2015 (UTC)
Good point. A google search yielded no results for International Falls being the center (other than this page), so I'll remove that one. --Lasunncty (talk) 01:56, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
DMS/DD
Some coordinates are Degree-Minute-Second, some are decimal. Please make them all the same system. Jidanni (talk) 21:51, 12 July 2015 (UTC) Good point. I presume the wikitext is the same as the source reference, and I think that should remain unchanged. But it would be good to use {{convert}} or some other tool so that the text visible to the reader would be consistent. I may get to this, but I'm not promising. YBG (talk) 00:48, 13 July 2015 (UTC)
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