Je suis fasciné par les langues d'Afrique et j'ai lu quelque part que les langues Kordofanes pourraient être liées aux langues nigéro-congolaises. Je ne comprends pas trop pourquoi certains experts pensent qu'elles pourraient être des langues anciennes ou bien des immigrants plus récents. Qu'est-ce qui nous permet de savoir si c'est l'un ou l'autre ?
Origin

The language family most likely originated in or near the area where these languages were spoken prior to Bantu expansion (i.e. West Africa or Central Africa). Its expansion may have been associated with the expansion of Sahel agriculture in the African Neolithic period, following the desiccation of the Sahara in c. 3500 BCE.

According to Roger Blench (2004), all specialists in Niger–Congo languages believe the languages to have a common origin, rather than merely constituting a typological classification, for reasons including their shared noun-class system, shared verbal extensions and shared basic lexicon. Similar classifications to Niger–Congo have been made ever since Diedrich Westermann in 1922. Joseph Greenberg continued that tradition, making it the starting point for modern linguistic classification in Africa, with some of his most notable publications going to press starting in the 1960s. However, there has been active debate for many decades over the appropriate subclassifications of the languages in this language family, which is a key tool used in localising a language's place of origin. No definitive " Proto-Niger–Congo " lexicon or grammar has been developed for the language family as a whole.

An important unresolved issue in determining the time and place where the Niger–Congo languages originated and their range prior to recorded history is this language family's relationship to the Kordofanian languages, now spoken in the Nuba mountains of Sudan, which is not contiguous with the remainder of the Niger–Congo-language-speaking region and is at the northeasternmost extent of the current Niger–Congo linguistic region. The current prevailing linguistic view is that Kordofanian languages are part of the Niger–Congo language family and that these may be the first of the many languages still spoken in that region to have been spoken in the region. The evidence is insufficient to determine if this outlier group of Niger–Congo language speakers represents a prehistoric range of a Niger–Congo linguistic region that has since contracted as other languages have intruded, or if instead, this represents a group of Niger–Congo language speakers who migrated to the area at some point in prehistory where they were an isolated linguistic community from the beginning.

There is more agreement regarding the place of origin of Benue–Congo, the largest subfamily of the group. Within Benue–Congo, the place of origin of the Bantu languages as well as time at which it started to expand is known with great specificity. Blench (2004), relying particularly on prior work by Kay Williamson and P. De Wolf, argued that Benue–Congo probably originated at the confluence of the Benue and Niger Rivers in central Nigeria. These estimates of the place of origin of the Benue–Congo language family do not fix a date for the start of that expansion, other than that it must have been sufficiently prior to the Bantu expansion to allow for the diversification of the languages within this language family that includes Bantu.

The classification of the relatively divergent family of the Ubangian languages, centred in the Central African Republic, as part of the Niger–Congo language family is disputed. Ubangian was grouped with Niger–Congo by Greenberg (1963), and later authorities concurred, but it was questioned by Dimmendaal (2008).

The Bantu expansion, beginning around 1000 BC, swept across much of Central and Southern Africa, leading to the assimilation and extinction of many of the indigenous Pygmy and Bushmen (Khoisan) populations there.
« Kordofanais »

Les différentes langues kordofanaises sont parlées au Soudan central-sud, autour des Montagnes Nuba. « Kordofanais » est un regroupement géographique, et non génétique, nommé d'après la région du Kordofan. Ce sont des langues mineures, parlées par un total d'environ 100 000 personnes selon les estimations des années 1980. Les langues Katla et Rashad présentent des isoglosses avec la famille benoue-congolaise que les autres familles n'ont pas.

Les langues Laal, Mpre et Jalaa, en voie de disparition ou éteintes, sont souvent rattachées à la famille nigéro-congolaise.
### Query ###
Je suis fasciné par les langues d'Afrique et j'ai lu quelque part que les langues Kordofanes pourraient être liées aux langues nigéro-congolaises. Je ne comprends pas trop pourquoi certains experts pensent qu'elles pourraient être des langues anciennes ou bien des immigrants plus récents. Qu'est-ce qui nous permet de savoir si c'est l'un ou l'autre ?

### Main Text ###
Origin

The language family most likely originated in or near the area where these languages were spoken prior to Bantu expansion (i.e. West Africa or Central Africa). Its expansion may have been associated with the expansion of Sahel agriculture in the African Neolithic period, following the desiccation of the Sahara in c. 3500 BCE.

According to Roger Blench (2004), all specialists in Niger–Congo languages believe the languages to have a common origin, rather than merely constituting a typological classification, for reasons including their shared noun-class system, shared verbal extensions and shared basic lexicon. Similar classifications to Niger–Congo have been made ever since Diedrich Westermann in 1922. Joseph Greenberg continued that tradition, making it the starting point for modern linguistic classification in Africa, with some of his most notable publications going to press starting in the 1960s. However, there has been active debate for many decades over the appropriate subclassifications of the languages in this language family, which is a key tool used in localising a language's place of origin. No definitive " Proto-Niger–Congo " lexicon or grammar has been developed for the language family as a whole.

An important unresolved issue in determining the time and place where the Niger–Congo languages originated and their range prior to recorded history is this language family's relationship to the Kordofanian languages, now spoken in the Nuba mountains of Sudan, which is not contiguous with the remainder of the Niger–Congo-language-speaking region and is at the northeasternmost extent of the current Niger–Congo linguistic region. The current prevailing linguistic view is that Kordofanian languages are part of the Niger–Congo language family and that these may be the first of the many languages still spoken in that region to have been spoken in the region. The evidence is insufficient to determine if this outlier group of Niger–Congo language speakers represents a prehistoric range of a Niger–Congo linguistic region that has since contracted as other languages have intruded, or if instead, this represents a group of Niger–Congo language speakers who migrated to the area at some point in prehistory where they were an isolated linguistic community from the beginning.

There is more agreement regarding the place of origin of Benue–Congo, the largest subfamily of the group. Within Benue–Congo, the place of origin of the Bantu languages as well as time at which it started to expand is known with great specificity. Blench (2004), relying particularly on prior work by Kay Williamson and P. De Wolf, argued that Benue–Congo probably originated at the confluence of the Benue and Niger Rivers in central Nigeria. These estimates of the place of origin of the Benue–Congo language family do not fix a date for the start of that expansion, other than that it must have been sufficiently prior to the Bantu expansion to allow for the diversification of the languages within this language family that includes Bantu.

The classification of the relatively divergent family of the Ubangian languages, centred in the Central African Republic, as part of the Niger–Congo language family is disputed. Ubangian was grouped with Niger–Congo by Greenberg (1963), and later authorities concurred, but it was questioned by Dimmendaal (2008).

The Bantu expansion, beginning around 1000 BC, swept across much of Central and Southern Africa, leading to the assimilation and extinction of many of the indigenous Pygmy and Bushmen (Khoisan) populations there.

### Supplementary Text ###
« Kordofanais »

Les différentes langues kordofanaises sont parlées au Soudan central-sud, autour des Montagnes Nuba. « Kordofanais » est un regroupement géographique, et non génétique, nommé d'après la région du Kordofan. Ce sont des langues mineures, parlées par un total d'environ 100 000 personnes selon les estimations des années 1980. Les langues Katla et Rashad présentent des isoglosses avec la famille benoue-congolaise que les autres familles n'ont pas.

Les langues Laal, Mpre et Jalaa, en voie de disparition ou éteintes, sont souvent rattachées à la famille nigéro-congolaise.

### Draft ###

### 1. Query Deconstruction

"Je ne comprends pas trop pourquoi certains experts pensent qu'elles pourraient être des langues anciennes ou bien des immigrants plus récents"

→ Core confusion: temporal vs spatial origin hypotheses
→ "anciennes" = indigenous pre-Bantu expansion 
→ "immigrants" = later arrivals to Nuba Mts

Key issue: User assumes either/or. Reality: both explanations valid for different languages.

### 2. Classification Evidence Hierarchy

**Strongest evidence** (multiple convergent factors):
- Noun class systems ●
- Verbal extensions ●  
- Shared basic lexicon ●
- Geographic distribution ●

**Weaker evidence** (single factors):
- Lexical similarities ◐
- Phonological correspondences ○

### 3. Kordofanian Position Analysis

Three possible scenarios:

**Scenario A**: Original Niger-Congo languages → geographic contraction
- Pre-Bantu expansion range
- Isolated from main Niger-Congo populations
- Nuba Mts = peripheral remnant

**Scenario B**: Later migration → peripheral isolation  
- Niger-Congo speakers migrated north
- Became isolated in Kordofanian region
- Main populations continued west/south

**Scenario C**: Independent development
- Kordofanian languages ≠ Niger-Congo
- Convergent evolution in Nuba region

Current consensus: Scenario A or B most likely. ●

### 4. Temporal Constraints

Bantu expansion ≈ 1000 BCE ●
∴ Niger-Congo family predates this by centuries/millennia
∴ Kordofanian position must be explained within this timeframe

Physical constraints:
- Nuba Mts = geographic barrier
- Isolation plausible but requires explanation
- Why persist without major population contact?

### 5. Evidence Synthesis

**Supporting indigenous origin**:
- Katla, Rashad show Benue-Congo affinities ●
- Suggests longer contact with central Niger-Congo populations
- Laal, Mpre, Jalaa more isolated ◐

**Supporting immigration**:
- Extreme northeastern position ●
- Isolated from main Niger-Congo regions ●
- Limited population size ●

**Critical uncertainty**:
- Which specific Niger-Congo branch? ◐
- Exact timing of migration/isolation? ○

### 6. Methodological Limitations

Comparative method strengths:
- Genetic relationships ●
- Shared innovations traceable ●
- Time depth estimation possible ◐

Methodological weaknesses:
- Reticulation vs tree-like relationships ○
- Population genetics data limited ○
- Contact vs inheritance ambiguous ⚠

### 7. Information State Assessment

Available evidence: Moderate ◐
- Linguistic similarities documented
- Geographic distribution clear
- Historical migrations known
- Population genetics incomplete ○

Knowledge gaps:
- Exact ancestral relationships ○
- Migration timing precision ○
- Population contact frequencies ○

### 8. Synthesis

Kordofanian languages = complex case study in African linguistic prehistory.

Most likely scenario: Niger-Congo origin with geographic/temporal isolation.

Evidence sources:
- Shared morphological features (noun classes, verb extensions)
- Lexical similarities
- Geographic distribution patterns
- Population history constraints

Key insight: "Ancient" vs "recent" = false dichotomy. Indigenous ≠ necessarily oldest.

∴ Kordofanian = peripheral Niger-Congo languages, probably indigenous to region but isolated during pre-Bantu expansions.

Methodological approach: Combine comparative evidence with geographic/demographic constraints for most robust explanations.

Remaining uncertainties require interdisciplinary collaboration (linguistics + archaeology + genetics) for resolution.

### Answer###
Votre question touche à un point fondamental de la linguistique africaine qui fait l'objet de débats depuis plusieurs décennies. Les langues kordofanaises constituent effectivement un cas particulièrement intéressant pour comprendre l'histoire des langues d'Afrique.

Les langues kordofanaises sont principalement parlées dans les montagnes Nuba au Soudan central-sud. Elles se divisent en deux groupes distincts : les langues Katla et Rashad présentent des similarités avec la famille benoue-congolaise (un sous-groupe du nigéro-congolais), tandis que les langues Laal, Mpre et Jalaa sont en voie de disparition ou éteintes.

La position géographique des langues kordofanaises - particulièrement leur localisation dans le nord-est de la région nigéro-congolaise - explique pourquoi leur origine génétique suscite autant de questions. L'hypothèse la plus répandue actuellement est que les langues kordofanaises font partie de la famille nigéro-congolaise et qu'elles pourraient représenter les premiers groupes de locuteurs nigéro-congolais à avoir habité cette région.

Cette question fondamentale porte sur l'origine géographique et temporelle de la famille nigéro-congolaise elle-même. Les spécialistes pensent que cette famille a probablement émergé dans ou près de la région où ces langues étaient parlées avant l'expansion bantoue. Cette expansion bantoue, qui a commencé vers 1000 avant J.-C., a balayé une grande partie de l'Afrique centrale et méridionale.

L'argument en faveur d'une origine ancienne pour les kordofanaises repose sur plusieurs facteurs : leur système commun de classes nominales, leurs extensions verbales partagées et leur lexique de base commun avec les autres langues nigéro-congolaises. Ces caractéristiques linguistiques convergentes suggèrent une parenté génétique réelle plutôt qu'une simple classification typologique.

Concernant votre question sur les critères permettant de distinguer une origine ancienne d'une migration plus récente, la classification appropriée des sous-groupes linguistiques est un outil clé pour localiser l'endroit d'origine d'une famille linguistique et comprendre sa distribution géographique historique. Cependant, aucun lexique ou grammaire "nigéro-congolais proto" définitif n'a été développé pour toute la famille linguistique.

La position particulière des langues kordofanaises - isolées géographiquement des autres langues nigéro-congolaises - rend cette question particulièrement complexe et les débats sur leur origine continuent d'alimenter les recherches linguistiques en Afrique.